east-west question丨kurt grotsch: cultural china in the eyes of a spanish museum director
2024-10-03
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china news service, beijing, october 3, title: cultural china in the eyes of a spanish museum director
——exclusive interview with kurt groch, founder and first director of the spanish flamenco museum
china news service reporter cui bailu
kurt grötsch, the founder and first director of the spanish flamenco dance museum, has traveled frequently between spain and china in recent years, actively promoting cultural and artistic exchanges and friendly people-to-people exchanges between the two countries. in 2011, kurt founded the spanish "friendly china" association, which is committed to creating a tourism model that improves the satisfaction of chinese tourists and promoting it in europe.
on the occasion of the 75th anniversary of the founding of the people's republic of china, kurt visited china again and accepted an exclusive interview with china news service's "east-west question" in beijing. he shared his decades-long relationship with china, as well as his observations and thoughts on cultural exchanges between china and europe.
video: [east-west question] kurt grocchi: cultural china in the eyes of a spanish museum director source: china news network
the interview transcript is summarized as follows:
china news service reporter: when did you become associated with china? what is your first impression of china? what new experiences did you have when you came to china this time?
kurt grouch:my trip to hong kong in 1998 was my first trip to china. when i was abroad, i always visited local barber shops. that was the first time i experienced chinese barber shops and services. it was a pleasant experience, the barber was friendly, young, helpful, had a sense of humor and was service minded. this kind of emotion that is good at understanding and sharing was also deeply experienced in my later exchanges with friends and partners at minzu university of china.
in 2007, "from titian to goya - art treasures from the prado museum" was exhibited at the national art museum of china, bringing together european painting treasures from the 16th to 19th centuries. the picture shows ribera's work "the penitent magdalena" that arrived in beijing from spain. photo by china news service reporter qian xingqiang
since 2012, i began to frequently travel to beijing and shanghai to participate in tourism expos and cooperate with chinese companies to drive more chinese tourists to spain.
europeans often compare their own country and the european continent with other countries and regions, always feeling that they are better. as china continues to develop, europeans today need to be humble and engage in in-depth dialogue and sincere cooperation with china.
when i came to china this time, i was surprised by the impressive and extraordinary changes that have taken place in beijing, a famous cultural city. this is challenging because culture is like an organism and will die if it is not provided with "nourishment".
chinese culture is fascinating. i also marvel at the chinese people’s awareness and pride in their country’s history and culture. in my understanding, chinese culture has two pillars, one is historical culture, and the other is contemporary culture. today, the chinese are integrating contemporary culture into china's cultural genes.
china news service reporter: over the years, you have been committed to cultural exchanges and people-to-people friendly exchanges between china and spain. what main tasks have you done?
kurt grouch:in a way, i feel a bit like a chinese. for example, chinese friends understand my jokes better than spanish people. in the past, spain lacked understanding of the chinese. in 2010, i founded an organization called "friendly china" to help european tourism agencies understand the needs of chinese tourists and provide better cultural and tourism services for chinese tourists.
at the same time, "friendly china" organized a series of exchange activities, including the "flamenco in the eyes of chinese people" exhibition in cooperation with the university for nationalities of china, and i became the "campus ambassador" of the university for nationalities of china.
in 2012, my partner marcelo muñoz and i co-founded the spanish think tank catedra china. in the past, china's image largely depended on politicians, so we decided to set up a think tank composed of experts in different fields to present a new image of china. at present, the "zhihua lecture hall" has brought together more than 400 chinese experts in various fields and has become a well-known think tank in spain.
china news service reporter: you founded the flamenco dance museum in 2006 and served as its director for nearly 20 years. what are the characteristics of european and chinese museums? how can both parties learn from each other?
kurt grouch:in europe, paris, london, berlin and madrid, barcelona, and bilbao in spain are all well-known museum cities, including the louvre, the georges pompidou national center for art and culture, the tate gallery, berlin museum island, and the prado. museums and other first-class museums are located in these famous cities.
most european museums and their permanent exhibitions have a long tradition and history, some dating back hundreds of years. these european museums attach great importance to increasing their collections, developing their own concepts, building a public image and connecting with society, investing energy and funds to attract more visitors, and are also committed to developing exhibition content and expanding their access to the public. in addition, private and semi-private institutions in europe have also created various unconventional exhibitions.
in 2017, the spanish flamenco dance drama "carmen", which has been performed around the world for a long time, was performed in fuzhou. photo by china news service reporter li nanxuan
i have visited museums in shanghai, xi'an, beijing and hong kong. when i came to china more than 20 years ago, i saw many old-style museums and antique showcases. when i visit again in 2023, the situation has completely changed. the modern and aesthetically-conscious museum makes me feel china’s innovation in cultural communication methods.
the invisible structure and management behind museums have increasingly made chinese museums places where people can relax, learn knowledge and achieve self-growth, and they have also become a proud part of the country. the value of chinese museums is not only reflected in tangible objects, but also in their intrinsic value and human spiritual wealth.
china's museums provide huge opportunities for cultural tourism. in europe, there are often seminars and knowledge exchanges about museums, and china is already an active member of them. many europeans don't know much about the specific work carried out by their chinese museum counterparts, but they are very interested in china's high-tech and immersive museums. to this end, both the "zhihua lecture hall" and "friendly china" where i work are preparing to visit china to understand this continuously developing cultural china.
the art space of the flamenco dance museum displays paintings, drawings and sculptures by artists from france, germany, poland, china and other countries. photo courtesy of the flamenco dance museum
reporter from china news service: flamenco, which you are paying attention to and researching, is one of spain’s national treasure art forms and is listed as an intangible cultural heritage of mankind. what are your thoughts on the inheritance and promotion of this kind of cultural heritage?
kurt grouch:flamenco is an artistic expression that combines song, dance and music. it has a history of about 3,000 years and can be traced back to 1,000 bc when the phoenicians brought castanets to the iberian peninsula. in the 8th century, the arabs brought songs, guitars and the earliest dance methods after they conquered this place. in the 15th century, gypsies from the punjab region (today's india and pakistan) arrived in spain through the silk road and incorporated some asian music and dance elements into flamenco. since the 17th century, the evolution and development of flamenco has been mainly concentrated in andalusia and extremadura, spain. the fusion of multiculturalism, as well as emotional elements such as loneliness, sadness, despair, happiness, love, passion, etc., together constitute the basic characteristics of flamenco art.
flamenco show. photo courtesy of the flamenco dance museum
i worked as a professor at a german university, teaching spanish and latin american culture courses, and then moved to seville, spain. there are many spontaneous flamenco performances and theaters (stages) in seville. i realized that flamenco is not only an art, but also an economic or cultural industry, but this thousand-year-old art does not any physical or historical information. to this end, i suggested and promoted the founding of the flamenco dance museum and have served as its director since 2006 for nearly 20 years.
currently, the museum has hosted about 3,000 tours around the world, including at the poly theater in beijing. until the end of the 20th century, most of these activities were privately initiated. in 2010, flamenco dance was listed as an intangible cultural heritage of mankind by unesco. since then, spain has regarded flamenco as a true cultural and national heritage and promoted it to other countries in the world, including china.
tourists view performance costumes at the flamenco dance museum. photo courtesy of the flamenco museum
today, about 30% of the visitors to the flamenco dance museum are from china. a few years ago, i taught flamenco at minzu university of china with museum ceo tina panadero. since then, the exhibition "flamenco in chinese eyes" was held in beijing and exhibited in seville, malaga and madrid. teachers from minzu university of china were also invited to spain to create and exhibit art works. later, i saw a painting from that time at the contemporary art museum in beijing.
these are just a few examples of “encounters and exchanges” between spain and china. today, there are many chinese art and traditional cultural performances in spain, and there are more and more flamenco performances in china. both sides should work together to find more new areas and ways of cooperation, which is one of the reasons why i came to beijing this time.
in september 2024, kurt grouch (first from left) attended the 2024 beijing cultural forum. photo provided by interviewee
reporter from china news service: spanish prime minister sanchez visited china in september this year and expressed his expectation that the two sides will strengthen exchanges in culture, education, science and technology, and deepen mutual understanding and friendship between the two peoples. how do you view the development of relations between china and spain and the role of cultural exchanges in it?
kurt grouch:in recent years, communication channels between spain and china have increased. in addition to official institutions, people-to-people exchanges are also frequent.
the first is tourism. although the number of chinese tourists to spain cannot be compared with tourists from european countries, tourism connects spain and china and creates opportunities for cooperation between the two countries in other fields.
secondly, many people who are committed to china-spain friendship have done a lot of work, such as wu haitao, the former chinese ambassador to spain, and yao jing, the current ambassador, to continue to promote friendly exchanges between the two countries at all levels.
finally, the number and quality of activities of organizations such as the "zhihua lecture hall" have continued to increase, providing more channels for people-to-people exchanges between the two countries.
the recent visit by spanish leaders to china shows that the relationship between the two countries is changing. this change should also be reflected in the fields of people-to-people exchanges and culture and art, not just at the economic and technical levels. (over)
interviewee profile:
kurt grouch. photo provided by interviewee
kurt grötsch, founder and first director of the spanish flamenco dance museum, served as director from 2006 to 2024; former president of the spanish flamenco theater association. founder and ceo of the spanish "friendly china" association, co-founder and vice chairman of "zhihua lecture hall", and president of citix world. in 2019, he was awarded the title of “campus ambassador” of minzu university of china.
