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bill gates: working better with ai and leveraging its capabilities is more important than understanding the internet

what will the world's richest man do when he retires?

bill gates answered this question with practical actions - devoting himself to the "future".

in the new netflix series "what's next? bill gates' future," which will be launched on september 18, gates delves into a range of topics including artificial intelligence, climate change, inequality, misinformation and global health.

to promote the new film, bill gates gave an exclusive interview to the verge magazine, detailing his optimism about how these technologies will shape the world in the next decade, while also being honest about the challenges and uncertainties brought about by technological progress.

reporter: in the first episode, you asked chatgpt to recommend an exercise you can do in the office. do you use chatgpt on a regular basis? how do you use it?

bill gates:well, actually, exercise is just one example, although that time it made for a pretty good answer.

you know, i often have to learn new subjects.chatgpt is a great way to get explanations for specific questionsi write a lot and it helps me a lot with my writing.

if i were to say the most used feature, i think for me it would be the meeting summary, which is integrated into microsoft teams, which i use a lot, and it’s great to be able to interact and not just get a summary, but also ask questions about what was in the meeting.

reporter: do you think microsoft should expand its cooperation with openai or invest more in its own technology?

bill gates:i'm an advisor to microsoft. it's doing a lot of its own stuff while strengthening its relationship with openai. i mean, the investment that microsoft and other companies are making in this space cannot be overstated.

reporter: this comes across in this series, too—about all the doomsday predictions. are you worried that artificial intelligence will destroy the world?

bill gates:well, the near-term question is more about how to use it in a positive way, like in health and education. even in the united states, we lack such solutions.

i went to see khan academy’s ai tool khanmigo in newark, which is based on chatgpt. it was awesome to see how it can help teachers do their jobs and help students who are falling behind or ahead stay engaged.

so,over the next decade, we will experience productivity gains in many areas, which is absolutely great news.。

as it becomes more powerful, you know, bad guys are using it, and that's going to cause problems. but overall, i believe it's a beneficial thing and we need to shape it in the right way.

bill gates visits khan academy

reporter: disinformation is an issue that researchers are concerned about ai accelerating. have you ever considered what you would feel if the generative ai tools microsoft helped develop had a significant impact on misinformation, climate change, and global health?

bill gates:i think, on the whole, ai is very helpful in responding to macro-environmental changes.

people are perfectly capable of writing misinformation in a word processor, they don’t need ai to create ridiculous content. so, other than generating deepfake videos, i’m not sure ai is really having a fundamental impact on the spread of misinformation.

in fact, i would say that when we talk about how to reduce misinformation, ai can help us monitor and respond to situations in a very efficient way.

as for the questions in this series—how to think about ai, how to eliminate malaria and improve global health, and driving climate innovation—these are key topics i’m currently working on.

as for misinformation, i think younger generations are going to have to make a complex trade-off between free speech and protection from misinformation.

ai training also consumes a lot of energy. how do you balance this reality with your ambitious goals in addressing climate change, given microsoft's increased greenhouse gas emissions?

bill gates:microsoft and other technology companies are actively looking for clean energy. they will become early adopters of energy such as geothermal, fission or fusion to help the development of green energy.

even from the most pessimistic perspective, the energy growth caused by ai data centers is well below 10%.

ai's contribution to scientific research is huge, such as how to make steel? how to make meat? what will the weather be like?

the benefits of ai far outweigh its impact as an electricity load, which is not as large as electric vehicles or electric heat pumps, or the impact of converting the industrial economy from direct use of hydrocarbons to use of electricity.

according to rhodium, from 2023 onwards, in a moderate emissions scenario, the expected sources of electricity demand growth are transportation at 46%, data centers at 22%, buildings at 16% and the industrial sector at 15%.

reporter: some of the technologies you invest in, such as carbon capture, have been criticized by some activists as a "false solution" to climate change because it does not eliminate fossil fuels or other pollution they cause.

additionally, nuclear energy development has sparked controversy over uranium mining near indigenous communities. how do you respond to these concerns about climate technology?

bill gates: i firmly believe that nuclear energy is essential to solving the climate problem.some nuclear power designs minimize climate problems in terms of safety, fuel use and waste disposal.

nuclear energy, both fission and fusion, has the potential to be a very cheap source of electricity in the future. we need to make sure we take responsible approaches to mining and waste storage, but we do need these technologies—what we need is energy that is not affected by weather and can supply electricity locally to supplement the construction of renewable energy。

we can also make nuclear fission as cheap as possible. for example, terrapower is trying to prove that we can make a safer and cheaper form of fission. (editor's note: gates is the founder and chairman of terrapower.)

people are right to be skeptical because it's never been done before, but as we build that plant, if it's successful, people will see more of the contributions it can make.

what about concerns about carbon capture? fossil fuels produce not only co2 emissions, but other pollution as well. how do you address these environmental justice issues?

(note: carbon capture technologies include a set of strategies for removing carbon dioxide from the atmosphere. these technologies may help slow climate change by capturing some of the pollution that fossil fuels have already released over the years. however, there are concerns about their cost, safety and their potential to delay the transition from fossil fuels to carbon-free energy sources. experts say carbon removal is still not a substitute for preventing greenhouse gas emissions in the first place.)

bill gates:in many countries, natural gas has edged out coal, which is good because in terms of local pollution, natural gas burns very cleanly and produces less carbon dioxide per unit of energy than coal.

and over time we'll have to move away from natural gas, too, but it doesn't have those local pollution problems. (editor's note: natural gas combustion produces nitrogen dioxide, a smog-forming pollutant and respiratory irritant.)

i know that many advocates are also concerned about methane leaks from natural gas infrastructure and even leaks from home gas appliances, and the impact that has on indoor air quality.

in the united states, people are no longer building new coal plants—they’re actively transitioning away, so the health benefits of getting rid of that local particulate matter is another reason to accelerate those transitions.

this is true all over the world, even though they are not as blessed as we are with cheap natural gas, which is why fission and fusion will play an important complementary role to renewable energy in much of the world.

bill gates at the 2019 world climate action summit

i know many advocates are also concerned about methane leaks from natural gas infrastructure and leaks from gas appliances in homes, and what that means for indoor air quality. but there’s excitement about nuclear fusion. even the experts i’ve spoken to who are optimistic think we won’t see it in the time frame required by the paris agreement. what makes you so optimistic that fusion will be ready in time?

bill gates: i have invested in five fusion companies, and although their timelines are relatively long, i believe fusion will play a very important role in the future.

given the challenges of scaling existing technologies and developing new ones, we will certainly not be able to achieve the 1.5-degree target, and we may not be able to achieve the 2-degree target.

so we're also going to have to be very innovative in terms of adaptation, making sure that the health, nutrition, and long-term well-being of people, even in poor countries around the equator, we don't let those conditions deteriorate.

although we will have climate challenges in the future over time, i don't think we'll have a climate catastrophe because we'll be able to deploy these new technologies. but you know, we can't avoid 2 degrees of warming, so we're going to have to have some mix of adaptation measures.

do you have any regrets about running microsoft? is there anything you wish you had done differently?

bill gates:well, i was learning all the time while running microsoft.

overall, i am very proud of this company and the work that is done.i was lucky that my successors continued the work, so it is still a great company today.

a lot of my learning about ai in areas like helping global health and education came from interacting with microsoft and talking to the top people there.so, you know, i'm really grateful to satya (note: satya nadella, current ceo of microsoft) for giving me this opportunity.

reporter: there is a lot of focus on antitrust right now, including breaking up tech giants. if microsoft had really been broken up in the early 2000s, what would the tech landscape look like today?

bill gates:these antitrust lawsuits, i don't know what's going to happen with them. when companies are this successful, they should expect this kind of thing to happen.

of course, they can see where microsoft is doing well and where it is falling short in addressing these challenges.

it's hard to second-guess these things. i mean, whatever part of the company i throw myself into, i'm confident it will be successful.